Notary Bulletin Q&A: Powers Of Attorney, And How To Handle Them By NNA Staff on July 12, 2012 in Hotline Tips, Signing Professionals, Best Practices, Financial and Corporate Services, Legal Professionals, Immigration, Laws & Regulations, Healthcare Professionals Whether a signer seeks a power of attorney (POA) for another person or is signing on behalf of a principal, powers of attorney add an extra layer of complexity to notarizations. Because it’s tempting for a dishonest person to abuse their positions when acting as another person’s representative, Notaries need to be especially alert for problems when notarial acts involve powers of attorney. The Section spoke with Bernard A. Krooks, founding partner of Littman Krooks LLP and past president of the National Academy of Elder Law Attorneys, to answer questions Notaries have asked about notarizations involving POA documents and representative signers. Many states don’t require signers to show Notaries proof they have power of attorney when signing on behalf of another person and having their signature notarized. Do you recommend that Notaries ask to see evidence a signer has power of attorney anyway, even if that’s not required by state law? Any time you’re asked to notarize a document, you not only need to see the signer’s ID but if they are acting on behalf of someone else, you should ask to see the document giving them that authority. I would recommend going even farther and also ask the signer to sign an affidavit that the power of attorney is still in force and in effect. A Notary recently called the NNA about an unusual situation involving a POA. The signer wanted to use an existing power of attorney to sign and have a document notarized granting herself expanded authority over her mother’s affairs. Can a signer use a power of attorney to increase their own representative capacity? Is it appropriate to notarize in this situation, or should the Notary refuse? The signer cannot do that. The only person who could expand the signer’s original power of attorney would the principal — the mother in this case. The agent can’t expand her power of attorney herself. She can delegate some powers to others if the original document authorizes doing so, but can’t add powers to herself. What are danger signs Notaries should look for if an elderly signer asks for a power of attorney to be notarized and the designated representative is present? It’s certainly not uncommon for people to take care of estate planning or powers of attorney in the company of friends or relatives. In many states, including New York, the agent is now required to sign the power of attorney document so it’s typical for the person named as the agent to be present. But if the Notary observes the signer appears to only be signing to appease the agent — for example, the agent says to the signer “I won’t take you to the doctor any more if you won’t sign this,” — that’s coercion or fraud. If a Notary sees this, the Notary needs to step back, ask the would-be agent to leave the room and talk to signer alone to ensure that the signer is willing. Email Share 28 Comments Add your commentjudith ortiz25 Jul 2014Can poa agents be added if the primary agent's health has become compromised and the principle is not able to .ale her own decisions?National Notary Association25 Jul 2014Hi Judith, Whether a person can legally be granted power of attorney or not would be a legal question which would need to be answered by a qualified attorney.Leslie Roden28 Jul 2014How does the POA agent sign? Do they just sign their name or do they have to add special wording to there signature " on behalf of" or something of that nature?National Notary Association30 Jul 2014Hello Leslie, thanks for your question. A person with power of attorney normally indicates that they are signing as "attorney in fact" for a principal. Here's two common examples how a power of attorney might be signed, where John Doe has power of attorney to sign on behalf of Mary Roe: "John Doe, attorney in fact for Mary Roe, principal" "Mary Roe, by John Doe, attorney in fact" It's important to remember that because the attorney in fact is the person who appears before you and signs the document, it is the attorney in fact's name that is entered in the certificate wording-not the principal's. More information on handling powers of attorney is available in our June 2014 magazine Beyond The Basics article, page 23. If you're an NNA member, you can log in to read the article at http://www.nationalnotary.org/knowledge-center/news/the-national-notary. Thanks and have a great day. Connie Sinn13 Aug 2014Do I have to have an attorney present when signing a POA in front of a notary or do I just need a witness?National Notary Association13 Aug 2014Hello Connie, Unfortunately, we can't provide legal advice regarding the requirements for preparing a power of attorney document. To find out if you require a witness or attorney present when having a power of attorney document prepared and signed, we recommend consulting with a qualified attorney. Abbey14 Aug 2014We got a POA onloine and my husband signed it before we realized it had to be notarized. will anyone still notarize it?National Notary Association14 Aug 2014Hello Abbey, Whether a previously written signature on a document can be notarized depends on the type of notarial act requested. If a Notary is asked to acknowledge a signature, the signature may be written prior to appearing before the Notary, but the signer must appear in person and provide satisfactory proof of identity. If a Notary is asked to perform a jurat, the signature must be written in the Notary's presence. Because nonattorney Notaries may not advise you on legal requirements for documents, you may wish to consult with a lawyer to determine what type of notarization is required for the signature on the power of attorney and whether the document will need to be re-signed in the presence of a Notary Public. Jason03 Nov 2014Can I notarize a copy? Person emailed me the POA and I printed it out.. Can I get that copy notarized or does it have to be an original?National Notary Association03 Nov 2014Hello Jason, To help us better answer your question, can you please tell us what state you are commissioned in?Tarek Chami26 Dec 2014Does Michigan require a signers to show Notaries proof they have power of attorney when signing on behalf of another person and having their signature notarized?National Notary Association30 Dec 2014Hello Tarek, I forwarded your question to Bill Anderson, our VP of Legislative Affairs. Here's his response: "To my knowledge, Michigan Notaries do not have a duty to obtain proof that a person is the attorney in fact for a principal signer. Following are the relevant statutes: 565.264. Certificate of person taking acknowledgment. Sec. 4. The person taking an acknowledgment shall certify that the person acknowledging appeared before him and acknowledged he executed the instrument; and the person acknowledging was known to the person taking the acknowledgment or that the person taking the acknowledgment had satisfactory evidence that the person acknowledging was the person described in and who executed the instrument. This statute basically states that in taking an acknowledgment, a Notary must certify that the Notary identified the signer as the person who executed the document. 565.266 Acknowledged before me, meaning. Sec. 6. The words “acknowledged before me” means: (a) That the person acknowledging appeared before the person taking the acknowledgment. (b) That he acknowledged he executed the instrument. (c) That, in the case of: (i) A natural person, he executed the instrument for the purposes therein stated. (ii) A corporation, the officer or agent acknowledged he held the position or title set forth in the instrument and certificate, he signed the instrument on behalf of the corporation by proper authority and the instrument was the act of the corporation for the purpose therein stated. (iii) A partnership, the partner or agent acknowledged he signed the instrument on behalf of the partnership by proper authority and he executed the instrument as the act of the partnership for the purposes therein stated. (iv) A person acknowledging as principal by an attorney in fact, he executed the instrument by proper authority as the act of the principal for the purposes therein stated. (v) A person acknowledging as a public officer, trustee, administrator, guardian or other representative, he signed the instrument by proper authority and he executed the instrument in the capacity and for the purposes therein stated. (d) That the person taking the acknowledgment either knew or had satisfactory evidence that the person acknowledging was the person named in the instrument or certificate. This statute says that the words “acknowledged before me” in an acknowledgment certificate mean that a person signing as POA executed the instrument by proper authority as the act of the principal signer. So, part of the attorney in fact’s acknowledgment to the Notary is that the AoF executed the document with proper authority. In other words, the AoF must acknowledge this; the Notary has no duty to obtain any proof, but is required to obtain the AoF’s acknowledgment." Angela Naatz28 Jan 2015When notarizing a POA, Can I use the California All-Purpose Acknowledgement for a POA or do I have to use the POA form (4307)? Which is best? Thank you!National Notary Association28 Jan 2015Hello, When performing any notarial act in California, you would need to use the appropriate wording as set by state law. If you are performing an acknowledgment that will be filed in California, a jurat or a proof of execution, the certificate must include the new notice wording that took effect Jan. 1.Rich17 Mar 2015I had a POA written for my mother online. The document was signed by her, in front of two witnesses and myself. We were under the impression that it did not need to be notarized at the time. If I would like to have it notarized now will everyone have to be present?National Notary Association17 Mar 2015Hello Rich. I apologize, but determining what witnesses must be present for a signature on a power of attorney document is a legal question we can't answer. You would need to contact an attorney or the appropriate receiving agency for instructions on this matter. Judy L. Reidy20 May 2015I am a real estate agent, and I have a contract to sell a home. My seller is elderly and living in the memory care unit of an assisted living facility in Texas. She had a POA drawn up in 2006, giving her daughter, who lives in Florida, all rights and privileges with no exceptions. The daughter in Florida cannot find the original copy of the POA. The title company which is handling the closing on selling the house the elderly seller has not lived in for years insists on having the original. Further, she refuses to close unless she goes to the seller herself and asks her questions about selling the house before she will notarize a new original POA. Can she do that???National Notary Association20 May 2015Hello Judy. I'm sorry, but because this is a question about an individual title officer's actions during a closing, not notarial procedure, we would not be the right organization to answer this question. You may wish to contact an official at the title company if you have questions about their policies.marie02 Jun 2015Hello I'm a notary kn Texas. I nototized a PO A.my mistake was signing my name on the principal line.The principal passed away before I could correct mistake.Now the bank willnot accept POA from daughter to withdraw money due to my signer instead of her mothers signature. How can I fix mistake? Please helphttp://bible.com/apphttp://bible.com/appNational Notary Association02 Jun 2015Hello Marie. To change or correct a completed power of attorney document, you would need to contact an attorney for legal advice and guidance.Robin04 Jun 2015Hi, I'm a notary in CA. I have someone signing a home loan with a POA for her mom and her dad. If she has to sign twice on a form like the DOT (once for mom, once for dad), do I need to complete two certificates?National Notary Association04 Jun 2015Hi Robin. POAs and home loans may have additional complications when notarizing. I've forwarded your question to our Information Services Team and will post here when we receive a response to your question. Thanks for your patience.National Notary Association04 Jun 2015Hi Robin. Here's the response to your question from our Hotline Team: "The Notary can complete 1 acknowledgment with the signer signing as POA, multiple times. In the acknowledgment wording the Notary will indicate that 1 person appeared, with signing multiple times in multiple capacities. Below is an example of how the part of the acknowledgment will read. The areas highlighted, the Notary will leave plural: “he/SHE/they executed the same in his/HER/their authorized capacity(IES), and that by his/HER/their signature(S) on the instruments the person, or the entity upon behalf of which the person acted, executed the instrument.” If the Notary is using our certificates, they can also fill out the optional section to include the parent’s names and the capacity in which the signer signed." I hope this information helps answer your question. If you have any additional questions on this topic, Robin, please feel free to contact the Hotline team at email@example.com. Robin05 Jun 2015Thank you for the response - that is very helpful.Oscar20 Jun 2015A poa was signed by individual appointing an institution. Also a affidavit of correction was notarized and signed by poa. Would I be able to sign as poa on the documents? And on the affidavit could I notarized it, and some one else sign as poa? Is this legal?National Notary Association22 Jun 2015Hello. You may not notarize a document in which you are named or have an interest. If the document gives you power of attorney, or you are signing the document as attorney in fact representing another signer, you may not notarize that document due to conflict of interest.Elsa13 Jul 2015In California...wife has a general POA to sign on behalf of deployed husband. Wife wants to notarize a loan document where she will sign as the spouse and ALSO on behalf of her husband by POA. The loan is from the husband's retirement fund (TSP). Is it legal for her to sign for herself and for husband by POA?National Notary Association15 Jul 2015Hello. Please contact our hotline team at firstname.lastname@example.org or 1-888-876-6827 for assistance with this question. Thanks.Leave a Comment Required * Name * Email *(for verfication purposes only) Comment * Enter the text shown in this image *(text is case sensitive)All comments are reviewed and if approved, will display.